session 4 - chinese philosophy, qin/han dynasties

Although it is probably the most brutal of the philosophies that we learned about, I find Legalism to be the most realistic of the philosophies. I would have chosen Confucianism except for the inferior, submissive status in which it places women. I didn't get that so much from the lecture, but more from the readings for Korea. Mohism makes me think of Hippies or the idea of a Utopian society, which is, in my opinion, completely unrealistic and undesirable. Daoism just doesn't make sense to me because I have a hard time with the idea of something being undefinable. I can have faith in something that can't be seen or touched, as in God, but the idea that the Dao is "everything, all the time" yet can't be defined or described means, to me, that it does not exist and is not real - it's a made up idea. Legalism, however, makes sense, even if I disagree with many of its ideas (the brutality, the idea that history is useless, etc.). The idea that the state should have clear, widely disseminated and strictly enforced law, no matter who you are, makes sense. It can be harsh, but it makes sense. The idea that people are self-interested, like pleasure and avoid/fear pain; therefore you can make people do anything with rewards and punishments is a little pessimistic, but has a truth to it. I'm really looking forward to our debate on this and would love to do this activity with my students!
edited by kmoore on 8/3/2011

Throughout history, Chinese philosophy such as Confucianism, Mohism, Daoism, and Legalism shaped the society in all East Asia countries. They still carry the profound influence amongst people of East Asia. Through debate to discuss each of the Chinese philosopher's system and ideology is certainly a great way to engage students in learning. I would like to experience as how our debate goes first. As next, I would think ways to design a lesson plan for my upper level Chinese students focusing on the Chinese philosophy.

Throughout the Chinese history, Chinese philosophy has been molded to fit the prevailing schools of thought and circumstances in China. The Chinese schools of philosophy, except during the Qin Dynasty, can be both critical and yet relatively tolerant of one another. Even when one particular school of thought is officially adopted by the ruling bureaucracy, as in the Han Dynasty, there may be no move to ban or censor other schools of thought. Despite and because of the debates and competition, they generally have cooperated and shared ideas, which they would usually incorporate with their own. For example, Neo-Confucianism was a revived version of old Confucian principles that appeared around the Song Dynasty, with Buddhist, Taoist, and Legalist features in the religion.
The debate of hundred schools and the debate exercise should be a great experience for our learners to have better understand the Chinese philosophy and the history.
edited by wchu on 8/3/2011

Fellow Mohists,

In preparing for the dabate, I found the following links helpful in presenting concise, easily understandable information on Mohism.

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/mohism/

http://www.chinaculture.org/gb/en_madeinchina/2005-09/27/content_73492.htm

http://www.newsfinder.org/site/readings/mo_tzu/

See you all tomorrow!

--RF

I found the answer to your question about what the threefold test and fourfold standard for policies was about. According to Britannica.com, Mozi "...insisted that standards of judgment be established, and his criteria may be summarized as the threefold test and the fourfold standard. The threefold test reminded thinkers that the basis, verifiability, and applicability of any proposition must be analyzed; the fourfold standard reminded thinkers that one should always assess the benefits any proposition could bring to the country and the people. Benefits were defined as enrichment of the poor, increase of the population, removal of danger, and regulation of disorder. To Mozi the tests and standards were indispensable. Generalizing further, Mozi declared that, before anything could be said to be good, it was necessary first to demonstrate what it was good for." Hope this helped.

This session was perfect for me, as I teach 6th grade and cover the three main philosophies (not Mohism). The video that Arana suggested sounds good; I must view it. I agree with Robin when she says there is no hiding in a debate, either you know it or you don't. The chart was very helpful in preparing for our own debate. Plus, the information from today's session helped to reinforce my knowledge of the philosophies.

Regarding Emperor Qin, I never knew he had died on a road trip and was smuggled back with a load of fish. Interesting!