War Atrocities

I don't blame Ho for the war itself; obviously the French and US have much to be blamed for. But as to the question of casualties, I think he was willing to sacrifice millions for a unification that, as you stated, was inevitable, but not necessarily on his terms. Likewise, Kissinger and Nixon also bypassed oppportunities for settlement for their own political purposes. I disagree with characterizing Ho as a teacher. In retrospect, I think he was more of a Stalinist ideologue than ardent nationalist. Had he lived longer, I don't thonk the status of Vietnam today would be much different.

I wonder why African-Americans are not deserving of reparations. 350 years, separated families, cultural devastation, physical abuse, mental duress. Sufviving Jews and families are now demanding reparations for slavery, and winning, under the Germans, it was not enough the Germans paid for the camps and deaths.

Is there some kind of doubt about slavery in the US and what it did to African-Americans then and for another 90 years after emancipation?

The only doubt I have in my mind is if Britain is going to own up to the fact that they are responsible for some 200 years of African slavery in North America and help make amends.

Reparations can come in many forms: cash, free continuing education, financial assistance (at bottom dollar) for small businesses and home purchases.

My mother's family (the rich part, anyway) owned several thousand slaves in Virginia in the colonial period. I am prepared to accept full responsibility toward my fellow Americans. I bet it wouldn't have cost any more than this illegal, murderous war the current administration has got us and our kids into.

Now, let's consider the Native-Americans..........or are casinos considered reparation?

As for Japan, like Turkey, could it be that the present generations feel no obligation to apologize for what the older generations did? The San Francisco Treaty, eager to create a non-communist Japan that would be a wall against communist expansion, told Japan they would never have to worry about any reparations. Though the world political climate has changed, they still have that legal precedent to fall back on.

When Japan's Prime Minister Murayama apologized in 1995, Asians said he was not sincere enough, when PM Koizumi apolgized in 2005, Asians did not accept it. Just what is an apology? Who must say it? How must it be said? Is there some pecuniary method involved? Will it bring back the dead or stop future conflicts and wars?

Bill Clinton apologized to all kinds of people for America's abuses. Many of those groups are still not content and continue to be critical of this nation. So just what is it going to solve? How much responsibility is on the critics and victims to accept the sentiments and move on? Or have they earned the right to permanently discontent till the day they die?

I am for reparations and apologies, if they accomplish something. Not if they lead to unending emotional and physical "milking" of a people's dignity, society, and finances. Justice has limits. Japan has a bit farther to go to reach those limits, but without international standards or tribunals, who will set them?

The final discussion on The Rape of Nanking was really interesting. At first I wasn't really satisfied with how the professor explained why the Japanese were so brutal, or the added (true) comment that America is at fault for it's own atrocities as well - neither made up for the sheer brutality of the torture the Japanese enflicted on the Chinese; it is something beyond explanation. The rational behind the German mentality during the Holocaust was the fact that they were taught to believe Jews were dogs, subhuman, not worthy of life. The Japanese treated the Chinese the same way, why? For the same reasons?

After my 11th grade English class reads The Joy Luck Club I do a mini lesson on Nanking, to show exactly what Suyan Woo was running from when she was forced to abandon her twin babies. My kids are shocked when I read to them some of the eye-witness accounts, how much these poor people were tortured in the sickest ways you can think of.

In my opinion what is almost as bad as a lack of apology from Japan is the fact that this event isn't taught in our own "politically correct" curriculum. My students knew nothing about it. I was glad that throughJoy Luck I had a vehicle to share with my kids this very tragic but important historical event.

Here is a copy of the brief article mentioned:
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WORLD IN BRIEF / JAPAN
WWII leader's kin to run for election
From Times Wire Reports
May 16, 2007

The granddaughter of wartime Prime Minister Hideki Tojo, who was executed for crimes against humanity, said she would run for a parliamentary seat in July to "restore the honor" of those who gave their lives for Japan.

Tojo, prime minister from 1941 to 1944, unleashed a savage war on Japan's neighbors and ordered the surprise attack on Pearl Harbor that plunged the United States into World War II.

Yuko Tojo, 67, said she would run as an independent from the Tokyo constituency for the legislature's upper house.

In a separate statement, Tojo called for a national debate on punitive postwar treaties imposed on Japan.
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I agree with what kjoy said. I don't think that Tojo has much of a chance winning this election, especially with all the ill-sentiments towards the Japanese already for their role in WWII. If she were elected it would be a slap in the face to China, even if she wants to bring forth a debate on what happened. It sounds to me like this is more for sensational value then a true political one. It would be like Hitler's grandson running for office in Germany - probably not going to happen...

The RAPE OF NANKING BY Iris Chang ( I think I have the last name correct) is an interesting prize title read. I heard her speak in Wes Los Angeles about two years ago , shortly after that she had committed suicide. She was from San Francisco.
The resurrection of the conservative movement in Japan may be having a reprieve since Tsuneo Watanabe, Chairman and Editor in Chief of the Yomiuri Shimbun Newspaper has denounced the visits to the Yosukuni Shrine, the WW ll war shrine honoring criminals from the Nazi Era. The paper wrote that the visits were unnecessary and showed a willful ignorance of Japan's dark wartime histiory. The articles have been gathered in a book titled, "From Marco Polo Bridge to Pearl Harbor:Who Was Responsible?" What is unusual is that Watanabe is one one of the "shadow shoguns" in Japan who govern Japan from behind the scenes , and a leader of the patriotic movement in Japan. Previous to this he had said that Japan had apologized enough. He is attributed to the nationist sentiment found in Japan.
Why the shift? It could be that he is a businessman and the lack of responsibility is leading to frigid relations between China and Japan or perhaps he feels it is the right thing to do. This whole discussion has been frozen in time because China and Japan were on opposite sides of the Cold War and now old feelings have thawed into new discussions. This article was in the Los Angeles Times on Monday January 1,2007, Page C-4. I kept it because it somewhat contradicted our discussions about the conservative swing within Japan. So much of Japan's history must be viewed through the lens of geography and Japan being an archaepalegio.

Seems this one has gotten hot. Not wanting to add too much fuel to the fire, I wondered if tools of war such as Napalm, agent orange, and C-130 20mm gunships are only objects with which one can commit attrocities?

This aside, this weekend the LA times had a full two page article on Korean comfort women. Many articles have surfaced in the last year as the Japanese seem unable to admit or take take resposibility for behavior and policies carried out during the war. As I read this thread, it got me thinking.

Since we are now on the topic of Vietnam in this thread, I wonder if the treatment of Vietnamese women during the Vietnam war could in and of itself be a silent attrocity no one in America is very willing to discuss. Having not been in Vietnam during the conflict I am aware I give little insight, but at least in terms of Hollywood Vietnam--a constant sexual tension always seems to be an issue. I am not trying to completely liken the cliche ME LOVE YOU LONG TIME GIimage to the forceful actions taken by the Japanese toward many of the women of the lands the conquered, but I can't fail to see some similaritites.

In both cases women were made available to soldiers, and I am sure most did not do this very willingly. In Japanese controlled Asia an Arisaka rifle and long bayonet assured compliance, while in Vietnam--from the hollywood perspective at least--huge profit, ruthless pimps, the hope of escape, and necesity seem to have been the motivating factors. What these two events share is the that due to war the unneccessary exploitation of women occured to further military goals. What must this look like in Iraq or Afganistan?

I am glad someone mentioned the treatment of women during the Vietnam war by the U.S. I do believe their was a highly organized system of having Vietnamese supply sex labor to the U.S. soldiers. The U.S. military has used it to recruit soldiers into the military. When my brother was being encouraged to join the army they told him they'd be women available. Also the U.S. military bases around the world but specifically in ASIA are notorious for there sexist and mysoginistic ways. In the Philippines their has been a movement to get the U.S. military bases out of their country. Along with this movement their has been a call for an end to the soldiers sexist practices including rape. I read that in these militray bases they provide soldiers with picture of prostitutes and if they find out one has AIDS or a sexualy transmitted disease the militray personal that handles this aspect of the militray puts an x through the face of that particular prostitute. As someone mentioned before I do wonder how the U.S. military is treating the women of the two current countries the United States is invading.